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Hi Lee
It’s good to see your name again and know that you are using support because struggling on your own is hard – all of us, whoever we are, need support at some time or another.
You know you can live gamble-free so believe in yourself as those who know you on this site believe in you.
I will follow your progress.
Velvet

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Hi Cat
Some posts have me grinning from ear to ear and this is one of them – fantastic – well done
Velvet

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Dear Jenny
It doesn’t sound mad that it is easier to cope with the ‘horrible’ person – you have built your barriers against that horrible person, not Mr nice Guy. However it would be naïve to suggest that this behaviour couldn’t be a ploy, his addiction is manipulative and so your barriers must remain.
I promise you that the strong, I deserve better Jenny is still there – all the ups and down are to be expected after the experiences you have had. It is my belief that F&F build a backbone of steel when they learn about the addiction that has been hurting them and little by little it becomes a second protective skin. Most of the damage his addiction inflicted on you, was possible because you didn’t know what the hell was going on – now you do.
I ‘know’ that Vera had her tongue in her cheek when she wrote that CGs can read minds but I also know that many F&F feel that indeed this is the case, so I want to assure you that he cannot do this. The addiction takes away self-confidence and self-esteem leaving F&F vulnerable and afraid which then lends credence to the belief that the addiction has an unnatural power – but you are gradually reclaiming your self – you have recognised that you deserve more and although you are a little unsure at the moment your strength has been building and will continue to build.
I wish I had a crystal ball Jenny so that I could tell you what to do. I know that one drinking session is possibly not a relapse but possibly a slip that frightened him – I know that slips do scare CG who are really trying to recover and often they strengthen their resolve. Equally you don’t know if he is not drinking at other times and that is the dilemma F&F face when a recovery has been waved about as a possibility.
The bad stuff is nearly always forgotten when the good person shows their face and yes the addiction can show a caring exterior to get what it wants but you won’t keep falling for it if it is just lip-service – you now have your distance, your barriers, your knowledge and above all you are stronger. I am glad that it has become easier for you now you have ceased to rely on him for emotional support – every little victory adds to your strength.
I have no doubt that he also wishes he wasn’t an addict but he can change his life and that is the message I hope he is getting loud and clear. He can control his addiction; he can live the most fantastic life and strange as it may seem be a better person for having the addiction but having the strength to come through it.
I don’t know what your outcome will be but I know that ‘you’ will succeed. I do believe that F&F can make a difference to a CG – they cannot save them but by being strong themselves and standing against the addiction it is the best thing they can do for the CG and gives the most support – even if the CG does not recognise that at the time.
Maybe I will ‘see’ you later, I hope so although I realise that Brownies have a priority.
Velvet

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Hi Caroline
His progress sounds good but you are right not to get excited, it is early days – but true recoveries do have to start somewhere and nobody can ever judge when that is – not even the CG.
With regard to his slipping again – it happens, it doesn’t ‘have’ to happen but if it is nipped in the bud it need not be a negative thing.
He is going without support at the moment and that is not the best way forward but as long as he feels better for being gamble-free it is something for him to look back on if he slips – he needs good memories because at the moment they are not good.
This is a really difficult time for you I know – it is impossible not to have your hopes raised slightly but they will be heavily tinged with fear. I can only say ‘enjoy the gamble-free days’ and hopefully your pleasure will make him feel that what he is doing is worthwhile.
All that you have said you are doing sounds great; it doesn’t help to bring up the past when a recovery might be happening. I suggest you don’t praise but show your appreciation by being happier yourself – while keeping an eye on his behaviour at the same time. There is no point in blaming a CG for the waste of time and money because nothing will change what has gone before – you are maintaining a fine balance and that sound just right.
Speak soon
Velvet

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Hi Caroline
I hope to hear that your situation is improving but whatever has happened, you will, of course, be listened to with understanding.
It has been good to ‘talk’ to you in the groups – it is easier to be open when our words are not so public. I am not going to write anymore at the moment unless you post again and of course I hope to ‘see’ you tomorrow, I will keep your seat warm.
Welcome back.
V

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Dear Jenny
I am not surprised you are overwhelmed and struggling.
Your mum has a horrid infection and needs care but hopefully she will soon be back to health – I am sure if she knew how much stress you were under, she would tell you to look after yourself.
Your father has a nasty complaint but hopefully now that his painful condition has been diagnosed matters should improve for him.
Your children appear to be pressing all the wrong buttons at the moment so coping with them requires you to be fit. It doesn’t matter whether you are single or not, you are a mum and raising three children can be difficult and thankless at the best of times. I think many mums have felt at times that their families are falling apart (I know I did) but I have no doubt Jenny that you can survive this.
It is not my intention to oversimplify your worries but I am only too aware how steep and impregnable the mountain can be and I know for certain that looking after you and your health is the most important thing you can do for ‘all’ of your family.
In my opinion, the main worry that can be put on one side and left to stew is your CG who is selfishly only considering how life is affecting him. The addiction he chooses to indulge is his way of coping with life so for now Jenny, if it was me, I would ignore his texts and attempts to gain sympathy – and leave him to that addiction. He has proved he is not reliable and not fit at the moment to care for you or your children, as an active CG he is a liability that you can do without at the moment. You will not be disappointed by him if you do not expect any support, either emotional or physical, for now..
I think I am only reiterating what Worriedmama and Vera have said in their posts but hopefully when you put them all together they will help a bit.
Please keep talking, you are in our thoughts.
V
God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change
Courage to change the things I can
And Wisdom to know the difference.

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Hi Toyman
I believe that learning to cope and do the best thing for everybody, once there is an awareness of an addiction to gamble, is the right way forward for those whose loved ones have a problems with gambling, rather than trying to establish a cause.
I am not disabusing your wife’s assertion that she escaped into gambling because of a discussion between her and your son but I am concerned that this assertion tends to imply that you son was in some way responsible for your wife’s gambling binge whereas it was your wife choice to gamble – your son was not to blame.
Busy jobs do make it difficult for non-CGs to monitor finances and I understand that your children ask for small amounts here and there but unfortunately cash to your wife is the same as a drink to an alcoholic. I don’t know how old they are, but are your children aware that their mother has a problem with gambling? If they are aware they could be encouraged to only ask you or another trusted family member for cash.
It is possible Toyman from what you have outlined in your posts that your wife has a problem with gambling and is possibly not fully addicted in which case pulling her back from the brink would be fantastic.
Talking to CGs who have controlled their addiction, or who are trying to control their addiction, is considered by many CGs to be the best therapy available and often the only thing that made any difference and changed anything – it works for those with a problem over their gambling too. Please do not overrule GA – anything to support your wife has to be worth trying. For my own part, I saw counsellors, a psychiatrist and doctors because I believed the problem in my home was down to me losing my sanity. I explained everything that was going on in my home but not one of them ever suggested that another family member had a compulsion to gamble even though I now know that everything I was saying clearly pointed to this fact. It was only in Gamanon that I found the support that I needed.
‘If’ you still consider that your wife should see a physiatrist first and she would prefer that to going to GA, please ensure he/she is qualified in the addiction to gamble – I have heard of CGs who have convinced the psychiatrist that they do not have the addiction and then having got their ‘get out of jail free card’ they carried on indulging their addiction with alacrity.
You say you have been down this road before – is that recently? Has your wife used gambling as a means of escape many times before?
Your wife’s exhaustion is understandable whether she is compulsive or has a gambling problem. A CG cannot win, the addiction to gamble is one of failure and constant failure destroys self-esteem and self-confidence.
I will wait to hear from you again but in the meantime I wish you both well.
Velvet

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Hi Worriedmama
I hope you heard us. I was thinking about you. the group was great and your words are with us, even if you can’t be there.
V

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Dear Toymaker
Hurting yourself is definitely not the answer but I do understand why you feel as you do – all the members on this forum will understand every word that you have written. There really is life after the addiction however and you deserve that life, so please hang in – I will support you as much as I can and hopefully you will see your way through this nightmare.
There are no tricks I’m afraid but your health and happiness count for a lot – so please believe me – you do matter.
If I were you I would find a GA group in your local area. GA is Gamblers Anonymous and it does fantastic work with people struggling like your wife. A good time to encourage her to go to GA is in the aftermath of a gambling session when she is remorseful. Hopefully sitting with her peers she can open up about her behaviour and learn that there is a better way to live. Nobody understands a CG better than another CG and those who control their addition help the others to change their lives.
Did you download the GA20 questions?.
Gamanon is the sister group of GA and is for the families of those with this terrible addiction and I think it is an amazing organisation. Cyber space is great but sometimes it is better to sit round a table and feel the love and care of others who understand us – it was my salvation. With Gamanon you are talking in real time and CGs are not allowed to join (unless invited) so you can be entirely honest and share all your worries – believe me all the concerns you have spoken about will already be known in a Gamanon group..
You are not crazy. Your wife’s addiction wants you to be confused because it wants you to feed it – but with knowledge of her addiction you will be stronger and able to cope. I cannot tell you what to do but I believe it is important to put all money and possessions of value beyond the reach of an active CG. Where is she getting her money from? Does she have credit cards? Is there a reason that your wife is unable to work?
It is hard but in my opinion, the non-CG should take care of ‘all’ the finances, keep money in private accounts and hide the pin numbers.
Exploding made no difference, so maybe it is time to try something different. When you wife is listening in a quieter moment, perhaps you could ask her to let you support her – explain that you will not replace the I-pad but that you are not punishing her – you are supporting her. Ask her to go to GA and talk to them about the I-pad and how she feels about not having one.
Perhaps you could tell her that ‘you’ have sought support because you are taking the situation seriously and want to help her. Maybe introduce her to this site – our Helpline is terrific.
Keep talking Toymaker – you will find your way through this.
Velvet

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Hi Toyman
Welcome from me to Gambling Therapy – I hope you will soon know that you have come to the right place.
The arguing is horrendous I know and sadly will almost certainly lack logic and reason. How long has this poor behaviour been going on?
There is no instant fix I’m afraid but there are ways to cope. Although not recognised professionally the following is my favourite and used successfully by many including me:
When next you feel an argument building, that you neither wanted nor asked for, imagine her addiction in the corner of the room snarling and wanting to defend itself. When her addictive behaviour feels it is being attacked it leaps from the corner and forces its way between you whereupon all reason flies out of the window as her addiction seeks to blame you and demoralise you.
It is so important to remember that your wife is being controlled by her addiction but you do not have to be – you are therefore the strongest person in your relationship. The addiction she owns however is the master of threats and manipulation and this is not what you want to be.
My CG (compulsive gambler) explained to me that it was like having a having a head full of sand, there was no room for the love and hope I offered, it couldn’t get in and he responded to my attempts to support him with lies and deceit because he didn’t have any other coping mechanism. With the right support some of that sand can be tipped out allowing space for good thoughts and rational thinking.
I would not be writing to you now Toymaker if I didn’t know that the addiction to gamble can be controlled and wonderful lives lived.
The Gordon Moody Association (GMA) now offers a fantastic Women’s project and I cannot recommend it more highly. My CG went through the GMA programme years ago and lives happily in control of his addiction. If you contact our Helpline they will be happy to give you details
However your wife appears to be she is almost undoubtedly not happy, her addiction guarantees her feelings of failure and worthlessness. I cannot tell you what to do but maybe you could download the Gamblers synonymous 20 questions and leave them for her to see – I don’t suggest handing them to her as she will possibly rip them up and tell you she doesn’t need them. If she can have a time to read them, she will hopefully realise her behaviour is recognised and there is a lot of support for her.
Toyman I have to leave it there for my first reply to you. I have a Friends and Family group on Tuesdays 20.00 -21.00 hours UK time and it would be great to communicate with you in real time – just get your questions ready and I will do my best – you will be very welcome.
One final question – does your wife admit she has a problem?
Well done writing your post – the first one is always the hardest
Speak soon
Velvet

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Dear Anni
I appreciate that locking things away seems an awful thing to do but it is better than losing possessions and going through the agony of knowing your child has stolen from you. For a while I believe it is better to assume that your son cannot be trusted at all and protect yourself accordingly, however, in my opinion this should be done discreetly because while he is in an early recovery and getting support from GMA it is great if he feels you are totally on his side – you are right he will not be happy being reminded that you are remembering.
I understand completely that when your lives were turned upside down again, the terrible feelings returned and you reminded him that you had all been there before but, in my opinion, the most important thing to do now, with regards to his sessions at GMA, is to listen to him – you may not understand all he says, you may not like what you hear but he is getting the right tools for the job. The time for questions comes later – if they are still relevant.
I am fully aware of CGs wanting to draw a line in the sand and how it can easily be interpreted as ‘look away’, ‘don’t challenge me’. Following rehab it is more difficult for the non-CG to get it right and that is why, I believe, it is important to keep talking here. Your son won’t get everything right straight off; he will be struggling within himself. He needs space to grow and the ability to trust that, if he isn’t behaving quite the way you hoped, you will understand that he is trying. His recovery is not like yours, he has not instantly been gifted with all the insights and logic that you have but he can move mountains given time and understanding.
I cannot tell you what to do but personally I am positive you should not actively encourage your son to read your posts, if he is on this site he may well find them anyway. I know that many CGs do read our forum and they often struggle with what they read because the threads could be written by the people who love them and maybe have not had the ability to speak freely as we do. I believe it is important to write your thread for you own support however and not because it could be read by the CG known to you which is a dangerous precedent.
I firmly believe that it is not a good idea to read the thread of the CG known to you because they need to have the freedom to speak freely. My son did not tell me about his GMA sessions until I was studying to become an addiction therapist about 3 years after he left rehab. He wanted me to succeed and he shared his knowledge and experiences with me without reservation. He told me, for instance, that for a long time, in rehab, he blamed me for his everything – what would I have felt and said if I had known what he was saying? He needed to express himself without me seeing or hearing his words; he needed the support of those who understood him as I could not.
I am really not sure what good any agreement signed by your son can be to him. When an addiction is active such an agreement would be worthless to the CG. I think possibly you have done this for your own protection but, in my view, this document is best locked well away.
Keep posting your thought Anni – you are doing well.
Velvet

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Dear Donko
I don’t know how old you are but you are showing an amazing maturity.
In this forum we hear all the time how members didn’t confront their CG and accepted excuses and indefinable explanations for poor behaviour, inexplicable losses of money, possibly lies and evasions because they wanted to hear that all was well. No daughter/father, husband/wife, brother/sister relationship welcomes the news that an addiction is causing chaos in their lives – which is why active deception on one hand and self-deception on the other succeeds in creating the cycle that causes so much damage. Your story would have been very different if your father had been in that cycle and nobody had challenged him.
I admire your strength because I know how hard this has been for you. I am just so pleased that your concerns appear to be unfounded. You have never said you knew your father definitely had a problem; you have wanted to hear he was ok and now you have.
I wish you well with your University course.
Thank you for coming back with this update when you need not have done so – you are very special and I am very, very glad that I have had the pleasure of ‘knowing’ you for a moment in time.
Velvet

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Dear Caroline
How are things with you?
I won’t write anymore until I hear from you but I just wanted to let you know that you are being thoughts about.
Velvet

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Hi Jenny
I too have been thinking about you.
It would be great to hear it you are nearing the top of your mountain and to be able to throw a rope if you have got stuck.
I know it is long haul but you were a long way up when last I looked.
V

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Dear Anni
I am wondering if you are worrying that the future for your son will be bleaker than his siblings and peers. Basing my opinion on CGs I have actually seen taking control of their lives many take exceptional paths possibly/probably as a result of owning this addiction.
I apologise if the following sentence sounds judgemental – I just know how I was. I would imagine that before your son went into GMA you felt as though you were constantly pleading with him to change his life, checking on his behaviour, questioning his lies, crying, shouting, threatening, anything and everything to make him listen. When he went through rehab and determined to change his life he couldn’t know that you would not have those same questions and thoughts still in your head even if you were not voicing them, he couldn’t know when they might erupt again. Families do not necessarily have the right counselling when their loved ones are away but hopefully during the absence they will have looked after themselves and gained strength from not having the addiction in the home – undoubtedly they will therefore, in my view, have changed too. Trust is two-way and it takes a long, long time for everybody to find their way forward with new criteria.
Reunited again with the loved one and praying that things have changed (but not knowing if they really have) the family treads warily. How do I behave? Can I trust; do I forgive; do I encourage; do I praise effort? Do I mention x y z? Do I speak if I feel worried again? What if…….?
Your son is doing something today that suggests he is in possession of his tools – returning to base means, I believe, that he knows where to go when his recovery is wavering. It doesn’t mean he didn’t find support away from the rehab, it suggests he recognised that he was still in need of support of a different kind – and that is healthy and good.
When I first posted on this site only F&F living with an active addiction were considered in need of support. What came after the CG had determined to live gamble-free was not considered important for F&F – after all what more support could ‘they’ possibly want? I believe that this is probably the most worrying time – the pressure of getting it right can be overwhelming. So please keep talking Anni, it is a long, slow process and there will be ups and downs for a long time. Slips are not compulsory but it would be naïve to suggest they do not occur for many, however, they need not necessarily be negative, they are often a wake-up call that strengthens resolve.
You did use the group correctly but please never worry about hogging the floor – it is my job to ensure that everybody gets their support and I usually ‘know’ everybody from previous groups and shared posts on the forum.
To answer your question – yes my son has definitely found purpose and happiness and I am happy to tell you I personally know many others who have done so too.
Velvet

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