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It is not the presence of the machines. Or the tables. Or the race track. Or the lottery ticket. It is about gambling. The rush, the escape, maybe both or whatever the reward might be. Certainly not about money, winning or losing it. I can go to a grocery store and walk through aisles and aisles of booze (it is now legal to sell it in reg. stores in my state). I still don’t feel triggered to buy it. Yes, availability creates a demand but I know that people that live in states here where gambling/casinos are illegal drive hours and hours to cross state lines to get what they want.
My hb started as a teen with a 1 dollar ticket at the race track. He plaid dice, bet on sports teams and when he was old enough, found his drug of choice, the poker and black jack tables. He played in casinos, he played in the army with his friends, he played Backgammon for money and when nothing else was available, he even played slot machines. Anything for the rush combined with a way to escape (his words).
And yes, cgs can stop. Many did and many do every day. Nobody can “make” them stop, they have to come to that decision in their own time and for their own reason. It took me a very long time to understand it but at the end it made so much sense: why should an addict change anything if he/she doesn’t see the need because there is always someone who will cover their tracks, make and accept excuses, believe lies, forgive anything and everything, put food on the table, put gas in the car, pay the bills etc,. etc. That someone was me. The last couple of years because I had no choice but still. It might sound harsh but I wish, I just wish someone had told me the ugly truth and facts before my life was ruined along with his.Jack, don’t underestimate the power of a hug and good communication! When my world fell apart, I was alone. My family and friends live in Europe and my hb’s family blamed me for their own enablement. The only people providing support where the members of my GamAnon group. I still think, your sis should consider consulting a lawyer in re. to the assets. Especially about the family home. My hb convinced me to apply for an equity loan to pay off the cars and then falsified the application amount. I had no clue what was going on. But I do remember that I had to sign off on everything because the house was in both our names. A lawyer will be able to clarify all that.
As for having to watch a cg vigilantly, it all depends. Nobody knows if your bil will relapse. Personally I found it a lot easier to focus on myself and my daughter again once I had the safety measures in place and knew that there wasn’t much my hb could do without me finding out. My head was clearer and the constant anxiety decreased. Better late than never, because I had lost my house, my car, and everything else. Filed for bankruptcy for debt I knew nothing about and was left with no credit score to speak of. It doesn’t have to be this way. I can only speak for myself but I would have gladly traded the losses for the responsibility to monitor the money etc. for the rest of my life. A small price to pay imho. My hb is now in real recovery since his last inpatient treatment over 6 yrs ago. We are married but don’t live together. He has enough income to make a living and so do I. Should he ask me for money without a reasonable explanation and nothing to show for it, I would refuse. Trust is not a right, it’s a privilege that has to be earned.First of all, I cannot give you any legal advice. I can only share my own experience with the issues you mentioned. Your sister might want to consult an attorney to get the answers she needs.
I live in WA and we also have the community property law here. It makes dealing with the financial side of being married to a cg pretty difficult on top of everything else. There are some things your sis can do to protect herself and the kids right now. She can sign up for a good credit monitoring service for herself and her hb as well. Can be done online and she should not share the password with her hb. Personally, I did not share the fact itself with my hb. She might also pull the credit records from all three agencies for both of them to see if there is anything he did not tell her. I got a post office box with only one key so I could check all incoming mail. That was very helpful. If the bank accounts are in her name only, she might want to have the bank put a red flag on the accounts in case her hb tries to go behind her back. No need to be embarrassed, my bank actually told me that I was by far not the only one with the alerts in place. If she does online banking, change the passwords frequently and not share them with anyone. If the car(s) is/are in both names, change the title to her only. My hb sold both of our cars behind my back. It is very important that she keeps cash and bank cards in a safe place at all times. Cgs are very sneaky and smart when it comes to finding resources for money. Last but not least she might want to make sure that the taxes are filed correctly. I left that to my hb and surprise, it resulted in a huge debt which left me no choice but to file separately ever after.
California has a Council on Problem Gambling and Gambling Addiction. It is located in Anaheim and you can find the website online. These councils are present in almost every state and are a great resource for info of all kinds.
Hope this helps a bit.
As an afterthought, your sister is very lucky to have you as someone to go to for help and support! It is so very important to not fight the battle alone.Vera was blunt in her post and I agree with her 100%! Why sugar coat it, the truth hurts but also pushes one in the right direction at times. That’s just my opinion of course. Had I listened to my inner voice when the gambling issue first started to mess with my life and me, for that matter, I had put my foot down right away. The reason my hb finally made a last attempt with an inpatient, longterm treatment was only that I told him No More. No matter what it would do to me, my finances, my everything. Only when he had no way out did he make the decision to wrestle the beast and put it in a cage. He just knew that I was serious and would not budge. For us, it worked. He has been in recovery for over 6 years now and has become a very different person even if our marriage only exists on paper these days. Just saying….
Your last post spoke to me. I have suffered from depression and extreme anxiety my whole life and finding out that I had married a cg made both much worse over the course of about 26 years. Even now that my cg is in recovery, my own issues are still a huge problem. Certainly also because the “aftermath” of the gambling years is still ongoing as far as finances etc. are concerned.
You asked about abuse. Yes, I have experienced it as well. Never physical, but painful nevertheless. The lying, the deceit, the blaming, the disrespect, taking advantage, not caring if there was food on the table, you name it, I lived it. I was told that I was the reason for my hb’s gambling. redirected the anger he had towards himself to me. Everything was just my fault. If I didn’t give him money, I was mean and controlling. I was told that nobody appreciated him. I guess that’s how he justified his trips to the casino. I, too, hated myself for putting up with it even after I had learned about the addiction and its dynamics. The person I was would have never put up with it. My problem was that I had given up my home, my family, my friends, my job and therefore my independency to follow my hb to this country because of his job. I had dug myself a hole so to speak and like to think of the enabling as involuntary. I had no choice.
I agree with Velvet to maybe give GamAnon a try, just to see that you are not alone. And that you are not a person you need to hate but rather caught up in your gf’s insane addiction. Have you ever thought about getting help for your mental health issues? Maybe it would help you to find a way out of the desperate situation you seem to be in right now?
Sad mentioned that she is not abusive but feels rather guilty towards her family. This is something I have seen too. My hb would every now and then morph into an extremely guilt ridden person who tried to accommodate every need he detected in me, our daughter and our extended family. Never lasted long, at least not as far as I was concerned. Then it was back to the blaming game, the angry outbursts and condescending remarks.
There is life after gambling, go for it!Hi Jenny, it seems to me that you are a strong person and determined to rebuild your life without the addictions messing with it. Your kids and you are the most important persons now, what your ex does is his decision. Are you divorced yet? If so, do you have a custody agreement/order for the kids? Nothing is too outrageous for an addict to finance the addiction. It doesn’t surprise me, that your ex tried to get his hands on the benefits for the children. My hb stole our daughters savings right out of her piggy bank. Does csa know about his addictions? They should so that they know what is going on should he try something again.
I noticed that many posts of f&fs mention the constant terror they are exposed to by texts, emails and voice mails. I am old enough to remember times where all you could do was make a call. If you didn’t want to answer, you didn’t pick up and didn’t even know who called. The new technologies are a blessing in many ways but can also turn into a curse. People can intrude on your life, your home, your thoughts and mostly your feelings uninvited and with you on the receiving end. Have you ever thought about blocking your ex’s phone numbers and email address? Not only would this provide you with some much needed peace and quiet for you and the kids but it would also send him a clear message that you are not willing to put up with his shenanigans anymore.
I’m just brain storming here because I am finally able after all the years I spent caught up in my hbs insane behavior to approach the issue from a realistic and factual point of view. The more you can distance yourself from the distorted mind of your cg, the more progress you can make for you and most of all for your kids to live the life you deserve.
It is a very painful road but every step is a step in the right direction. At least imho. Stay strong, you are worth it!!!!There seem to be some red flags in what you wrote in your update. GA doesn’t require a referral from a GP and no appointment is necessary. From my own experience it looks a bit like buying time and satisfying your expectations. My hb is in recovery for almost 6 yrs now and told me that he never wants control of his money again. For him, it is part of his recovery. He gets a certain amount each month to pay his bills (we don’t live together) and the minute he asks me for something out of the ordinary, I pull the plug so to speak.
I have some thoughts on the money issue with the dad but it is strictly my own opinion. Every addiction thrives in secrecy. I would not talk to his family myself but encourage your bf to disclose what is going on. After all, as long as there is money available, there is really not such a great need and urge to stop gambling. Always something to fall back on. I don’t think a drug addict or alcoholic would be in a good place if dad would finance the substance. Indirectly that is what is happening looks like.
And the issue with presents is also connected to the secret. Nobody would ask questions if the gambling is revealed. The greatest present I ever got was the change I saw in my hb after being showered with gifts for 25 years that he could not afford, charged on credit cards for which I had to file bankruptcy in the end. I had no clue how many cards he actually had, go figure. Just some stuff that came to my mind when reading your post.Thank you for your kind words. It took 25 years, 3 inpatient treatments and many relapses to get to this point. My hb also spent a year in prison because of a gambling related crime. I don’t know what his ex told his daughter about his uninvolvement in her life, but am sure it was not very nice. My daughter was 14 when her dad was sentenced and it was hell for the both of us. She did not appreciate being in the dark for so long. Of course she noticed the tension, the fights, the money problems and my desperation but didn’t understand what was going on. I had to tell her that her father was in jail when I picked her up from school the day of the arrest. Today, I would talk to her about it. After all, she learned about substance addiction in school and now they even have cg included in the curriculum. My daughter and I were part of the group that developed the material and that helped her a great deal. As for my step daughter, she now has a little boy and is adamant to protect him from the fall-out caused by my hb’s gambling and her stepdads drinking. It took years for her and her dad to rebuild their relationship. She just watched him for a long time to make sure he rally did change.
Talking to a 4year old is very hard. But if he doesn’t change, some age-appropriate info and conversations might help to sort her feelings out in the long run. I feel so sorry for your little girl, i cannot begin to tell you. What a blessing that she has a mother like you!!! And btw, our marriage did not survive. We are still married on paper and have managed to become good friend. Took a while and still seems very strange but it works.Hi Michelle. I can see your struggle to protect your little girl in your posts. When I met my hb, he was already a cg, I didn’t even know what that was at the time. He told me that he was divorced and had a daughter who was 5. It was obvious, that he loved her very much. He lived in Germany at the time and his daughter on the US west coast. Needless to say that he didn’t see her much. According to him, his wife divorced him because …the reasons were many and changed over time….I believed him. He splurged financially when it came to his daughter even though he didn’t have the money really. A year later we moved to the US and things got ugly. Hie ex wanted their daughter to visit us but only during a certain time, no matter how hard we tried to tell her, that the flight was unaffordable on these specific days. She put her daughter on the phone (not quite 7 at the time) and the little girl asked why we didn’t want to see her. She did not come of course.
When my hb was forced into medical retirement, we had no money for months until I got my job back. My hb could not pay the child support and when things got better, he just didn’t want to pay. I was the one making him get the money orders each month, adding a sum for what he owed. He received a letter from his daughter in the mail asking him to please pay the support. A little girl in the middle of all this crap. My hb was mad at his ex and she was mad at him. It was a terrible situation and it went on until his daughter was 18. Always about money with the ex and I hated what was going on. His daughter finally broke free of the dad hating past and they started to build a relationship that was shattered again when he relapsed.
What I had not been told (but suspected) was that the divorce was caused mostly by his gambling. Some really bad facts emerged through the years. Since my hb started his true recovery almost 6 yrs ago, he has a good relationship with his daughter but it took years to come to this.
Today, I understand some of the behavior his ex showed. Been there myself with my own daughter with the only difference that she was older and my hb had no funds to even support himself.
I think a therapist might be a good idea but it would have to be one who is knowledgable about cg. Your ex is and will always be your daughters dad, no matter what. If he becomes an absentee father who puts her last, it might scar her for years to come. Nobody can tell you what to do and I just wanted to tell my story as an example how it should not be.
What really got me was that the ex wife married her long-time bf after she got pregnant at 40, knowing that he was and still is an active alcoholic who relapses badly after long periods of sobriety. So now there are 3 children involved in this addiction mess. Adult or not. I think you have come a very long way in a short amount of time!Hi Michelle, this all sounds so familiar to me. It sounds like you have not really made up your mind yet what you want to happen. Your cg does what cgs do when the addiction is fully alive and well and nothing else seems to matter. I do believe he loves his daughter but gambling comes first, at least at the moment. I used to thrive during the days (later on only moments) when it looked like my hb finally was ready to do something about his gambling. Constantly on a roller coaster and the downfalls got steeper and steeper over time. There came a point when I came to a screeching halt and decided that enough was enough. I became very calm and made up my mind that I would take no more. The decision to remove him and his gambling from my life as much as I could, no matter what he would do was like lifting a burden from my shoulders. Even if he had not finally gone to inpatient treatment and started his true recovery, I would have never gone back to the everyday insanity.
Have you decided what you want from him? What are your boundaries, especially as far as your little girl is concerned? Children rather come from a broken home than live in one. I would not let your daughter observe, see or hear any of the arguments, whether about money or visitation. If he wants to see her, I would let him but not tell her beforehand. What comes out of his mouth is white noise. He might have the intention to spend time with his daughter but the addiction always gets in the way. So instead of hoping and wondering and getting all worked up and angry, maybe it would be better so just sit down and make some kind of a plan what you want your life to be like. Maybe set some boundaries and tell him if he wants to come at 2 he can have maybe 30 min to be late and then he is out of the picture for that day. Something along that line. You don’t depend on him financially which is a great, great advantage you have.
The longer and the more often he gets away with his behavior, the more he will try to manipulate you. If you quietly and calmly set some rules you are able to keep yourself, he will get the idea that he is on his own with his best friend, the addiction. I might just be rambling here and it is all my very personal opinion as an outsider who has been there for way too long. But only after my point of no return did I quit to call my hb, look at his mail, tried to find out where he was and when etc. And found piece of mind. Don’t ask me what it cost me to achieve it.
I wish you luck and hope your daughter grows up a happy girl. Have the cg-free vacation you two deserve so much.Hi Michelle, if I got your post right, you paid for the vacation and can go with or without him? First of all I know the romantic fantasy of a perfect family only too well. It gives hope that one day, just one day it will all come true. Rarely does though. You did recognize the enabling part, that is good. Maybe there is a way to turn it into something nice for you and your daughter. Do you really want him to go? And if he does, will it be a a nice time for you? If you have serious doubts, just go on without him. Take a friend like you did in the past and go and have a blast!
If you would like him to go with you, why not set him a deadline and tell him to come up with his share of the cost at a certain day and if he doesn’t, for whatever reason, go on without him. Personally I think that would not be enabling because he will not reap the benefits without doing his part. At least in my opinion. Cgs make promises all the time and have no problem breaking them without a second thought. Mine did it all the time. He bought stuff for our daughter and then never had the money to pay any important bills. When my daughter got older she told me that all she wanted was for her dad to be there and not to cause us so much pain. The material things meant nothing to her and she also thought that her father was all about money and never about the relationships, no matter with whom.
Maybe going with your child and a friend would do you more good than adding him to picture, I don’t know. Not an easy decision for you at this time. I hope it works out the best way possible and you are able to enjoy your hard earned vacation!I hear you loud and clear when you talk about your father’s eval. My hb was diagnosed with bipolar disorder. As are so many other cgs. He has not had any significant mood swings since he quit the useless medication when he first started inpatient treatment. The ugliness you describe is real and painful for everyone involved. Personally it also did me some good. I set out to learn all I could about cg and in the process shed all the shame and whatnot once I understood that it is his disease, not mine. I had nothing to do with it. Not with the gambling and ultimately not with his recovery either. Other than reaching my own rock bottom and telling him that no matter what happened, I would not be part of this insane dance anymore.
At least cg is now a disorder in it itself in the DSM V instead of just lumped under not specified compulsive behaviors. A step in the right direction. So I think it is very important for non-cgs to get all the information they can. It did help me a lot to get a perspective on his and my own issues.
I agree with you re ownership. Always believe in it and always will.
As for me, I’m glad that I don’t have to live with the active addiction anymore. It did so much irreversible damage that some of it will stay with me for the rest of my life due to my situation being somewhat unusual and having some other issues of my own.I read this when you first posted it and it is so true, at least for me. I would like to add something here if you don’t mind. Through all those years I had to live with the incredible ugliness of cg, I was made aware over and over again that a lot of people do not accept that cg is a disease, just like any kind of substance abuse. The people I met who work in the field called it the silent disease. We cannot smell it or see it. While not many people hide a loved one’s addiction to alcohol or drugs anymore, gambling is not talked about much. Lots of folks still believe that all it takes is the willpower to stop. Period. And I don’t exclude myself when I think about the start of my painful journey. I didn’t understand it and thought that all my hb needed to do was to decide to just quit. I kept it hidden for a long time because I was ashamed of it. Where I come from, gambling was illegal for a long time, the few casinos were operated by the government and regular people couldn’t afford to go there. As a result, gambling addiction was something dirty and only dark.
When everything erupted in chaos and my hb went to prison, it added to the shame and he was seen as just another criminal. I am sure that nobody would have treated my daughter and me as bad had he turned out to be an alcoholic or a drug user. Society accepts this way more readily still than cg. So that adds to the ugliness of it even more than just the gambling itself. Just my point of view.So that was the first breakthrough for your wife I guess. Good for the both of you! What stuck out for me was that she asked you to help her cure her addiction. I’m sure you know already that neither you nor she can CURE the addiction. It can be controlled but will always be there. Just like a recovering alcoholic can never drink again, she cannot gamble ever, including anything that has only remotely to do with it. I’m a stickler for language, sorry, so for me there is a difference between help and support. Maybe it’s the same, I’m not sure. Personally I would chose the word support. Support in her efforts to jump of the slippery slope of cg. Are you sure there is nothing to forgive? For me, forgiveness is a huge part of supporting a cg. But again, JMHO. Every addiction is a beast, but also involves actions and choices the addict makes. I think that the many yrs of apologies, cries for help, pleads for forgiveness etc. I heard from my hb just wore me out. I so hope that the two of you can tame the beast.
I don’t believe that you can or should try to take her mind of gambling, that is part of HER recovery work. If she is serious about it she will gradually set different priorities for her life, including you and your son and find joy in other things than gambling. I would like to suggest that it might be helpful to find a GA group she feels comfortable with and there are many of those who offer a GamAnon group at the same time and in the same building. You could make that a part of your schedule and join forces to fight the beast off. I did that for a while with my hb and even though he was still a long way from true recovery, it helped us to put some things into context. This is all just how I see things but maybe it gives you some ideas.Maybe it would help you to block the emails. You don’t have to open them in fact it is better to not do that. You can block numbers on your cell phone as well. I block the hell out of junk mails and calls/texts from people I don’t want anything to do with. Usually really easy to do and prevents them from showering you with messages you don’t want.