Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Hi Logic, I am on a break from cleaning out my sheds/home educating my son in the garden so this is only a very quick one. Have you read the post ‘the gambling cycle’? I know you read a lot on here so you probably have but I will bring it back up to the top just in case..
Two more quick things – don’t be thrown off what is best for you by your partner, don’t let him or his addiction hold you back. I can tell you categorically the best thing you can do for him is by doing what is best for you in terms of life choices. I have my fingers crossed for you for Friday.
And £150…at the pub? Really…
Your doing great, stay strong and look after yourself, Lily x
Hi Peanut,
Good to see you posting. There are many elements to your story not the least the fact you live in possibly the worst place in the world for a compulsive gambler. My partner visited Las Vegas once, he ran away with a large sum of money and was penniless with no ticket home within 12 hours! I can see why your husband would want to stay away and for his sake and in the long term yours, I am glad he has.If your husband is working on his recovery (and the fact he hasn’t stayed in Vagas is a good sign he is) then he will not have room for much else at this time. If your husband loves you and the relationship is one that can be saved his recovery is the only way it could ever be healthy and sustainable. Equally in these situations the recovery of the partner is just as vital. Learning about enablement, moving forward with yourself and nurturing a happy, healthy you is the only way to foster a happy healthy relationship. For these recoveries people often need time and space which may be seen as a selfish thing, actually it is self care and self care needs to happen before we can ever truly care for another person.
Some times when self care leads to self improvement it means we grow away from a person or relationship, sometimes it heals things and brings us closer together either way it needs to happen to allow room for the people involved to blossom and lead fulfilling lives.
In my opinion showing your care from a distance and without demands as you did for his birthday is the best thing you could do, the fact he replied speaks volumes. Getting support for yourself, enjoying your life as it stands and working on any issues you may have isn’t about moving away from him or leaving the marriage behind, it is about doing what is necessary to have a happy life, it means you have space for another person once that improvement starts to take effect.
I can not predict whether or not your husband will return to you and in truth neither can you but if he does (and please don’t let it be in Vagas) then it is far more likely to work out long term if you are both strong in your recoveries. My partner and I were separated for 7 years working on ourselves (not to get back together, we both believed it was over) and now he is back in my life we both appreciate the work the other one has put in and our relationship is the best it has ever been, he is gamble free and I am strong and independent, this enables us to support each other fully and as equals and enjoy our life everyday. If you are having a relationship with an active gambler what you are actually having is a relationship with the addiction and that is not a healthy situation. It is an old cliche I know but you both need to find yourselves before you can re-find each other.
Take care of you, find out what makes you smile and feel complete outside of the relationship, then the way forward will seem less daunting I promise. Lily x
Hi Logic,
It was lovely to see you offering support on Carmen’s thread and I am glad you are feeling a little better. With this addiction there are often some hard choices and decisions to be made but I think once we start seeing that we do have a choice it is a sign of our own recovery and can actually be empowering. The CG does not have a choice, they have to live with their addiction for the rest of their lives whether in denial, treatment or recovery, they can however make a choice to get help, but however hard it is for us to live along side this addiction, it is hard for them to see the addiction for what it is.
In your post you mention both you and your partner being consumed and that is what the addiction can do. It is like an encroaching poisonous fog that first envelops the CG and then those around them, all are suffering but can’t see a way out, there are signs however that you are now able to see over it and I think there are glimmers your partner is too. I think you are wise though to be cautious particularly with his family history and the situation he is in.
His recent behavior is probably down to panic, panic he is losing you to this job. A CG will like to keep the equilibrium, if you change and move forward he might have to too, sometimes when a CG is unable to keep up the charming facade it is because the addiction feels it is being challenged and starts thrashing about. The best thing you can do is keep calm and carry on, carry on with your recovery, your life, your plans, with looking after you.
Sometimes partners believe it is about leaving the person behind, it is not, it is about stepping back into you, that means you are strong, you are present and you are authentic, not swayed from your path by pressures around you. People talk about someone being their ‘rock’ and this is often seen as the person who is always there picking up the pieces however I think a true rock is the person who is centered in themselves that they can be a calm, unwavering force, a constant in a stormy sea. I heard an analogy the other day about being a light house,( it was related to having an autistic child who is very demand avoidant, but I think it relates well to CG’s too). ‘You need to be like a light house, there shining out so you are seen and recognised as a safe place but remembering you are not a life boat rushing in to save.’
Will you be there to take care of his car money? I think it is a good sign he has asked you myself, it may show he is recognising his own inability to handle money but just be careful it is not an elaborate rouse to make you feel that he is being sensible. Would he be willing for you to go car hunting with him so you can see the money handed over? I was shocked the other day when my CG told me he sometimes put in place the idea for a manipulation to get money or cover his tracks months in advance back when he was gambling, I didn’t realise it could be that thought through. You learn something new everyday.
Be kind to yourself Logic, you are doing better than you think and don’t give up hope anyone can change if they want to, some just take longer than others, Lily x
Hi Carmen,
I am so glad you have had a reply from Logic, I was thinking earlier about how you were in similar positions as regards having a long term partner who you obvious love and care for a great deal although you don’t live together and the gambling being a relatively newly discovered thing but of course as you say everyones story is different and everyone’s approach and journey is different.In no way did your post come across as critical of your partner or as if your partner was exploiting or using you or that he was in anyway a ‘bad’ person. Most CG’s i have come across my own partner included are very caring and often very sensitive and empathetic people, the addiction simply start to cloak these qualities and lead them down paths that they otherwise would not follow, such lying to a much loved spouse.
Vera has likely met far more compulsive gamblers than me and is in recovery herself so she has seen where it can lead, she also knows where it has lead her that does not mean she is a bad person or indeed any other compulsive gambler is, it is just an addiction that feeds on money and therefore the likelihood of issues in that area are great, therefore the measures needed to get more ‘fuel’ are often also great, and usually involve some form of lying and or manipulation. Vera is just wishing to warn you of these dangers.
As friends and family we will never tell you to end a relationship or indeed to stay in one, we know it is at the end of the day your relationship. My partner is the love of my life, my soulmate, him being a CG could never change that. We have both been together and apart and just good friends at different times. Through everything I have always remained true to myself and my feelings. I have taken advice from this forum and I have ignored advice from this forum sometimes I have regretted not taking it, some times not.
I see my relationship as a three way, me, him and the addiction. At times when the addiction is strong there has been no room for me, as his recovery progresses there is plenty of room for me and in turn less room for the addiction. I love my partner, I hate the addiction, my partner is a good man, the addiction is an evil thing which has controlled him at times.
I am sorry you felt comments were derogatory to your partner and your strength of feeling shows that here is a man worth loving and a relationship worth working at for you. I really hope that the couples counseling does work for you and is the start of your both moving away from the gambling which is blighting your lives.
I hope I haven’t offended you in anyway and if I ever do or you disagree you will tell me (I am sure you will) Lily x
Hey Red, stay strong. You know what you have to do and it is the ultimate act of love. I hope to meet you in the group again soon. Be extra kind to yourself this week, Lily xx
I am sorry you haven’t had any replies yet, the forum has been very quiet this week but hopefully I will be able to give you some support.
Your friend is fortunate to have such a caring friend but it is important that you take care of yourself and don’t make yourself sick with worry. Do you have someone to talk to or is there a student counselor or similar you could talk to about your concerns?
Things you can do for your friend are:
Do not give him money or bail him out. This is called ennoblement this is when someone acts as a cushion between the person and the consequences of their addiction so that they do not feel the full consequences of their addiction and the desire to get help wains.
Listen to him and his issues but do not get bogged down by it or ask too many questions, let him get there himself rather than cajole.
Do not accompany him gambling, insttead try and encourage him to do something fun elsewhere, other interests can help them see there is a life away from gambling.
Most importantly take care of you, seeing you seek help for your own issues will be a great example and help you deal with whatever life throws at you.
Keep posting, it might take a little while to get a reply sometimes but there is always someone to listen.
Lily x
Hi Logic, it is great to see you posting but please, please do it for you. This is the place you should be able to come to be honest about how you feel and get support for yourself. Yes we can advise on patterns, likely behavior and treatment for a partner or family member who is a compulsive gambler (CG) but primarily it is to help you through your journey.
I am not sure what you mean by I know it is CG? is it a typo? Did you mean I know it isn’t me? This addiction has a way of not only filling up the one suffering from it but the ones who come into contact with that person to. This is why we always say take care of you first and foremost.
It seems he is moving slowly forward, he wants to get help and he is right that is something he has to do for himself. A hey well done or I’m proud of you for seeing/doing that will go a long way, don’t get to involved listen rather than question when you can.
I am pleased you are going on with this interview and seeing your family at the weekend, thesse are good healthy signs for you. Don’t let the addiction fill you up make space for the joy and pleasure in life and that will keep you strong and ultimately be the best thing for you both.
Lily x
Firstly sorry for the delayed reply, I read it straight away and was mulling it over until I had time to do a proper post and had a lot to catch up on at home yesterday.
Well done for taking the bull by the horns I am pleased you had the conversation and you did well keeping him on track and saying calmish, actually having such a long conversation together is a testament to your relationship as most active CG will be out of there at the first mention of the gambling or so defensive it will be impossible to get anywhere.
It is obvious however he does not see the problem, he only sees you have one with him gambling, this is usual at the stage. For recovery an active CG must 1. admit HE has a problem 2,Want to stop 3. Restrict his access to money 4. Get specific professional help. Skipping to step 4 will not work, some do 3 and 4 in reverse order and in fact often that is the very last thing they are willing to do but it is essential to recovery not doing so to use your earlier analogy is like expecting a coke addict to give up with a bag of coke sat next to them.
Many CG’s are self employed I have found, this is so they have both the opportunity and the ready cash to gamble without being held accountable. The majority of CG’s start in their teens although it doesn’t always become an obvious problem until later on. Compulsive gambling is progressive and so as things get worse it gets more difficult to hide and they eventually get found out or come unstuck. It usually isn’t until they really hit rock bottom that they start to seek help and until then may see it as a hobby or something they enjoy even while it is getting them into trouble.
While I can see your logic with the relationship counseling I am very doubtful it will work even if he goes. He needs to recognise it is his problem before he can move forward and he needs somewhere he can open up and that won’t be in front of you, he has too much to lose. Chances are he is in far deeper than he has admitted even to himself. I hope you don’t mind but I ran the idea of relationship counseling by my partner and he said no way would it work, his feeling is that it would just put the problem back with you and the relationship rather than your bf looking at his own issues.
I am afraid your bf is where he is. I would suggest you let him look through one of the questionnaires you get online about signs you are a compulsive gambler as a starting point.
Perhaps also go and get counseling yourself to help you through this time and to show him counseling is a normal sensible thing to do for self improvement and to help deal with problems that crop up in life. It is not healthy or productive to obsess about what he is doing, from experience and 200 miles away I can tell you now the likelihood at this stage is he will be gambling, he has access to money, a raging addiction and no desire to stop so why wouldn’t he?
I am not saying give up on him but he will need time to come around to getting help. Love for you is not enough to stop him, it never is, they have to want to do it for themselves. My partner had already been admitting his problem for at least 10 years before he went into treatment, he went into treatment because I gave him an ultimatum and as he reminded me the other day I told him not to come home until be had started it. Wasn’t I clever, didn’t I get him in there? No because in residential treatment he was just going through the motions because that was what I demanded and it wasn’t until I recognsed this and left him that he began to engage. Fair play to him he didn’t have to he could of walked out but he did because he wanted to stop, he realised the affect it was having on his life and even then it was really hard and not completely gamble free for many years. Not everyone’s paths to recoveries are so long, my partner gambled a long time, he got to some low places, it was the only life he had know since he was 15 or so.
So the key points to my ramble are:
You can not save him
He has to recognise he has a problem and want to do it for himself
You need to take care of yourself and your needs which will be the best thing you can do for both of you ultimately.
Once again I have been extremely frank with you, I sense you can take it and you have said you don’t like pussy footing around. You are no ones fool and that is a really good thing, your CG is very lucky to have you around fighting his corner even if he doesn’t see yet that there is actually a fight on!
Sorry there are no quick fixes, take each day as it comes and take care of you, Lily x
Hi Logic,
I am sorry things have been tough. In what way? You know no matter how bad things are you can always post here, even if it is just a rant to let off steam, there is always someone to listen. I know in the early days sometimes I didn’t post when things were bad as I felt I was in someway betraying my partner but honestly everyone here knows how hard it can be and understand that when the addiction is controlling the person they are not the real them, it is important for you to have somewhere you can be totally honest without judgement and on the forum that is always true.I am glad you are still pursuing your own career and dreams that is so important and can only ever be the right thing to do.
Look forward to hearing how the interview went, Lily x
Just wanted to say I was thinking about you yesterday Velvet. I hope it all went as well as it could of and you are getting plenty of support and time for you. Lily x
hey Logic, how are things? Any news on the new job? Thinking of you, Lily x
Hi again Carmen sorry for not getting back to you yesterday. I spent the day with my son in A and E with suspected broken ribs after another child tried doing a slam down wrestling move on him! Thankfully just deep tissue damage.
Anyway, I hope things went ok yesterday and you perhaps got some answers although I also know getting a straight answer or having a constructive conversation with an active gambler can be a bit like herding cats!
You seem to have a really good head on your shoulders and a lot of common sense and ability to have an element of detachment which will stand you in good stead. The fact you were able to attend your class last night before your meeting with your bf was really good to see, one of the things that is so important is holding on to your own life, this addiction has the ability to consume those around it as much as those suffering from it. I read once than an average of 16 people are adversely affected indirectly by a compulsive gamblers addiction, much higher than any other addiction.
I have been thinking a lot about your relationship counseling idea, it might be a good place to start but I am doubtful it will go very far even if he agrees. The reason I feel this is because of the level of shame associated with CGing, it is very hard for them to open up often particularly to those closest to them. The addiction leads them to a place where they feel if anyone really knew them and what they got up to know one would love them, they tend to try and hang in there and believe the next big win will bail them out and make up for it all rather than seeing the problem for what it is and realising that even a big win would end up in the same place as they would gamble it all away all over again.
Having a counselor experienced in this type of addiction who they have nothing to protect or gain from makes it much easier to open up for them but again only if they are willing. The gambling is their comfort blanket, their happy place (they view it like this long after it has ceased being either happy or safe) and they protect it fearsomely. The alternative is having to unlearn all there ‘coping mechanisms’ (compulsive gambling to you or me), deal with the issues that causes it and all the problems it has caused both emotionally and practical and this can seem like an impossible task which is why they need specialist help. I suppose it is possible that relationship counseling could prove a catalyst for you bf to seek further help but I’s say its a long shot. The other thing of course is that it is his problem and not a relationship issue and so relationship counseling could give him an ‘out’ ie I only gamble because things in the relationship aren’t right, this is a common thing amongst cg’s, truth is it is impossible to have a healthy relationship with a CG as healthy relationships are based on honesty and trust and these things are not compatible with this addiction.
It is very common for a Cg to separate out his friends from his relationship, often ‘friends’ are people with the same or another addiction or those that enable also by compartmentalizing their lives it is easier to be able to keep up lies in order to support the gambling.
Most gambler are not abusers, most will manipulate in some way whether through charm or keeping their partner down or a mixer of both but this is general a product of the addiction rather than their inherent personality. Most Cg’s I have met are actually very sensitive, caring people underneath it all and I personally believe it is these very traits that make them hide in the addiction when emotions run high.
I am glad you have got a fulfilling life of your own and people around you can talk to and are supportive and that you yourself are not ashamed or afraid to talk this is the perfect situation to be in for a good outcome for you.
Please let us know how it went and keep reading and learning, knowledge is the best weapon against this addiction. Most of all keep taking care of you, Lily x
Hi Carmen
Great to see you replying. I have to take my son off to the docs this afternoon (I have one child not my CG’s) so got to post and run but just wanted to clarify my partner and I have not been together 30 years that’s how long he has been a compulsive gambler, we have been friends for 17 and in a relationship for part of that time on and off, long complicated story as they often are in these situations, read my post if you want the full story (shades of grey).I will reply more fully later and I am sure you will have other responses by then too. Glad you have your Mum to talk it out with, Lily x
I have just brought up a post on basic tip for dealing with a compulsive gambler which might help as a base point. It should be at the top or near the top of the list of posts now. Its called ‘some useful tips for friends and family’ Lily x